A Bit of Humor
Please take a quick look at the following 20 second video before reading the rest of this post which continues after the video. Once you resume reading the rest of this post, keep what you have seen in the video in mind.
First, a little background for those who don't follow politics or live in a different country. President Obama wants to pass a questionable version of a healthcare reform bill which has become a heated and mostly partisan issue. In this portion of his speecch to Congress, Obama, a Democrat, is explaining what the bill will not do. Representative Joe Wilson, a Republican, shouts out, "You lie!" because he doesn't believe Obama is telling the truth. (Rep. Wilson later apologized to President Obama for his rude behavior.)
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One morning during the church service our Calvinist Pastor (we're Arminians) announced that he would soon be begin an expository teaching on the book of Romans. A minute later my husband hands me a note. It read:
"When he gets to Romans 9 you must refrain from shouting, "You Lie!""
Needless to say, I struggled to maintain my compsure going back and forth from a poker face to a smile for a few minutes. :-)
Please know that we LOVE, LOVE, LOVE our pastor. Hubby was just having a little fun.
posted by Dawn @ 10/05/2009 07:13:00 AM
16 comments
16 Comments:
As long as he goes on to 10 and 11, everything should be fine. :)
I'm am just so curious as to how he's going to teach and explain these things that I can hardly wait. Especially Romans 9.
As I've mentioned in the past, we've never really delved too deeply into the subject with him. He preaches like an Arminian and simply states that God is sovereign. Though, we know his definiton of sovereignty is different than ours.
lol!
I would be surprised if a Calvinist pastor made it to Romans 9 in less than two years so patience will be of the essence.
You're probably correct, Leo. It took us over two years to get through the book of Matthew with a few topical teachings here and there. It was a great study. :-)
I have found that pre-trib/pre-mil churches tend to speed through the scriptures while traditional premil/ Amil/post-mil types are more deliberate since they are not necessarily looking for an immediate "rapture" Which mold does your pastor fit into?
Leo, our pastor believes in the imminent return of Jesus, His millenial reign here on earth and subsequent judgment of mankind, however, I'm not sure if that entails a "rapture". I think I had always assumed he believed in a rapture because of his belief in the imminent return of the Lord. I will have to ask him about the rapture part.
All religions are nothing more than archaic old myths. All primitive cultures have had their "creation myths" wich over the centuries, have evolved into the world's current religions. All are just old myths and made up stories.
If there IS a supreme, ultimate being/creator, god etc. It is unknowable. Anyone who pretends to know what such a being wants or claims to know the nature of such a being is living in a fantasy world.
You cannot rely on millenia-old myths, written by primitive, superstitious cultures to tell you anything real about anything. To do so is ludicrous
Talon5,
"All religions are nothing more than archaic old myths. All primitive cultures have had their "creation myths" wich over the centuries, have evolved into the world's current religions. All are just old myths and made up stories."
Well, Talon, that's simply your opinion, and you're certainly entitled to it.
"If there IS a supreme, ultimate being/creator, god etc. It is unknowable. Anyone who pretends to know what such a being wants or claims to know the nature of such a being is living in a fantasy world."
If there IS a supreme, ultimate being/creator, god, etc. (and I believe there IS One) then how do you know there is NOT one, especially if it is, as you claim, UNknowable? And, if there is a supreme being, then I would think that He has the ability to communicate with His creation.
The God I believe to be the One true God is the God of The Holy Bible. I believe He has chosen to communicate to us through His written word using certain people whom He has inspired to write His words (i.e., The Holy Bible). God has chosen to save people who believe in Him through FAITH. Maybe it is you who is living in a fantasy world because you don't want to have to answer to a supreme being/God so that you may be your own God.
"You cannot rely on millenia-old myths, written by primitive, superstitious cultures to tell you anything real about anything. To do so is ludicrous"
Maybe it is you who is relying on millenia-old myths, written by primitive, rebellious cultures to tell you lies about there being no such thing as God. To do so is quite DANGEROUS. If I am correct in my belief that there is a God and He has communicated to us through the various writings of men inspired by Him (i.e., The Holy Bible), and I obey His Word and receive His Son, Jesus, then I have lost nothing and have gained eternity in Heaven. If you, on the other hand, choose not to believe, then you have lost everything and will spend eternity in Hell.
I pray that you will seriously consider that there might just be a God who rules the entire universe and that He has chosen to communicate to you through The Holy Bible. I pray that you will accept what He has written and repent of your sins and believe on His Son, Jesus, who shed His blood and died for your sins and rose again on the third day that you might have eternal life with Him in Heaven.
Sorry, but to me the god of the bible is utterly ridiculous. Why would the ultimate being of the universe want to be "worshiped" or praised and glorified, etc. etc. etc. Is he insecure? Arrogant?
How can you justify a being that supposedly sends BILLIONS of people to be tortured forever in a burning hell, simply because they were raised in another faith? Read Numbers:31 where your god not only condones, but demands that the Israelites kill women and children and enslave even more.
Thanks but no thanks. The Christian idea of a supreme creator is extremely insulting to such a being in my opinion. You live in a fairytale fantasy world. I've never understood how so many people can be so ignorant and gullible that they would believe such nonsense.
Talon5, I'll have to get back with you later about your comment when I have more time. There is a logical explanation for your concerns.
Thanks for stopping by.
What religion a person follows is based almost entirely on where they were born. If you are born in India, you will be a Hindu, if you're born in China, you'll be a Bhuddist, etc. etc. People in the West are mostly Christian because that's where they were born, into a society that brainwashes their people practically from birth to believe in Christianity. I was fortunate enough to have parents that didn't force religion on me as a child, but instead, let me make up my own mind based on logic and reason and not on indoctrination like most other people.
Christianity is just old myths, no different than the Roman or Greek mythology, no different that tribal religions. Just old myths made up thousands of years ago in an attempt to explain existence and to keep people in line. Any intelligent person who actually thinks about such things using logic and reason will come to that conclusion. The problem is that most people don't question it. They just blindly accept what their parents teach them. What their culture teaches them. But if you were born in India, you would argue just as strongly for Hinduism as you do now for Christianity. It's your culture and where you were born that determines your religion. That's one reason (out of many) that I reject all religions.
I'm sorry I haven't responded to your comment. I totally forgot about it. I'll answer you today.
Part I
Talon5, you said, "Why would the ultimate being of the universe want to be "worshiped" or praised and glorified, etc. etc. etc. Is he insecure? Arrogant?"
Because He is God. He is not arrogant or insecure. He is a Holy, loving and righteous God who
deserves praise and glory, whether you're willing to believe that or not.
Talon5, you said, "How can you justify a being that supposedly sends BILLIONS of people to be tortured forever in a burning hell, simply because they were raised in another faith?"
If BILLIONS of people are going to Hell, it is because, sadly, they've refused to repent of their sins and believe on Jesus and obey Him. It is up to each individual. If you end up in Hell, it is your own fault. Right now, at this moment, God is reaching out to you. If you don't continue to reject Him and His Son, Jesus then you can go to Heaven when you die.
I realize you don't believe this, but I care enough for your soul to tell you the truth. You cannot stand before God when you die and say, "But God, I didn't know. No one ever told me about Your Son Jesus Christ and that if I would but believe/serve Him that I would be able to go live with You in Heaven. No one ever told me that there was a real place called Hell which is a place of eternal torment. No one ever tried to persuade me, even though it seemed silly, illogical, foolish and without reason, to believe that You exist and that You sent Your only Son, Jesus to die for me."
To Be Continued...
Part II
Talon5, you said, "Read Numbers:31 where your god not only condones, but demands that the Israelites kill women and children and enslave even more. Thanks but no thanks."
I can understand where you would see God as being cruel to kill women and children. There are several reasons why God commanded this event: love, mercy, protection and justice. Those children were exposed to the most evil things (i.e., worshiping false gods, incest, and other sexual perversions and were most likely going to be evil themselves and would perpetuate such heinous activity to their children and so on and so on. These children are now in Heaven because they didn't know any better. So, in the grand scheme of things, God had them killed as an act of mercy. The children are now in Heaven. They were spared living an utterly evil life and the children of Israel were spared exposure to such evil. The women were killed because of the same thing. They corrupted the men of Israel and would continue to do so. It was a protection from further corruption of Israel's community. No one was kept as a slave. They were lovingly given new homes and raised as Israelites to love and serve God.
Talon5, you said, "The Christian idea of a supreme creator is extremely insulting to such a being in my opinion. You live in a fairytale fantasy world. I've never understood how so many people can be so ignorant and gullible that they would believe such nonsense."
Why do you fight so hard against a God that you say you don't believe exists? And why must you be so insulting to those who do believe in the God of the Holy Bible? Does it make you feel better about yourself? You're exposing your true colors as a human being. You accuse God of being arrogant and insecure. It's ironic that you are exhibiting these very characteristics in your writings. You are no better than your misguided perception of the God you hate and don't acknowledge. Whether or not you choose to believe in God through His Son, Jesus, I think you should take some time to reflect on these flawed aspects of your character. I will certainly be praying that you would use reason and realize that God exists and that it is the most logical explanation for our very existence.
Talon5, I've read your website and can't help but wonder why you decided to have children? You say that people are bad for the universe and the earth. Would you care to explain why you would choose to further foul our nest by procreating?
I will respond to your latest comment soon.
Dawn
I don't fight agains a god, I fight against ignorance and stupidity and I fight for logic, reason and science. Sorry, but anyone with more than 3 working brain cells should be able to see Christianity for what it is, just archaic old myths from a primitive culture.
So...I take it you're perfectly okay with billions of people being tortured FOREVER in a burning hell, simply because they were raised in another faith? What is WRONG with you????? The brought it on themselves??????? How UTTERLY stupid!!! They were conditioned practically from birth to believe in Hinduism, Bhuddism, Shintoism, or whatever, just like you were conditioned practically from birth to believe the Christian mythology. Sorry, I won't post here again, you are buried so deep in your fantasy world that you'll never be able to escape from it. You should see a good de-programmer, I think they might be able to help. But you can wallow in your fairytale world with your invisible beings if you must. Have a nice life.
I noticed you didn't answer my question about why you chose to procreate if you feel that humans are bad for the universe.
I hope you will one day believe and trust in the Lord Jesus and will not have to spend eternity in Hell.
Have a nice life.
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